ROME (RNS) When Pope Francis cradled the small box said to contain nine bone fragments believed to be the mortal remains of St. Peter, the first pope, he fanned the flames of a long-standing debate over the authenticity of ancient church relics.
Most old churches in Italy contain some ancient relic, ranging from a glass tube said to hold the blood of St. Gennaro in Naples to a section of what is believed to be Jesus’ umbilical cord in the Basilica of St. John of Lateran in Rome. Perhaps the most famous religious relic in Italy — the Shroud of Turin, believed by many to be Jesus’ burial cloth — will go on display again in early 2015, and Turin Archbishop Cesare Nosiglia this week invited Pope Francis to attend its public debut.
Well written article. CLICK HERE
Photo: From HuffPo – Italian archbishop Rino Fisichella holds the bone fragments said by some to belong to the first pope, St. Peter during a ceremony of Solemnity of Our Lord Jesus Christ the King at St Peter’s square. | VINCENZO PINTO via Getty Images
Stephen Jones has done a fine job of starting to answer a question from Jeffrey Liss posed to Stephen:
"One question for you, though. I am curious why you prefer Barbet’s research to that of Zugibe. My recollection is that they reach different conclusions as to placement of the nails and cause of death."
The answer is incomplete, so far. Stephen tells us that he will add to his answer in a forthcoming part. "Why I prefer Barbet’s hypotheses over Zugibe’s: 2) The thumbs are not visible because of damage to the hand’s median nerve". I’ll keep an eye out for it.
But why wait. This is worth reading. Lots of quotations and useful diagrams.
Comments here are always open and rarely pre-moderated.
The questions are always there in my mind: Should I simply ignore webpages that are ridiculously wrong? Do I run the risk of hurting someone’s feelings by not doing so? One fellow shroud blogger has told me that he will not read my blog because of this; I’m mean. He would prefer to be “blissfully unaware” of what I write. No, really! Should I just email him, privately? He has asked me not to. Do I send comments to his blog? He will not allow most comments anyway. From me? As the sign on the approach to the Brooklyn Bridge says, Fuhgeddaboudit.
And another blogger has found that almost anything I say about him or what he writes is an insult. Fuhgeddaboudit? No!
I’ve pretty much decided that if someone blogs publically, he or she is agreeing to public criticism. If he or she relies on bad facts, I have a right or duty or pleasure to disagree publically. If he or she expresses incredulous beliefs – personal revelations from God, unique biblical inerrancy, scientism posing as science and whatnot – then it is fair to discuss this publically without fear of being insulting.
These are three quotations from a single recently published posting in OpenTheWord.org: A Bit of Bible, a Bit of Life, a Bit of Politics:
The Catholic church believes the image of Jesus was burned — if you can call it that — into the cloth at the moment of His resurrection.
No. Not true. The Catholic Church does not “believe” this or claim this is so. Some Catholics, some Mainline Protestants, some Anglicans, some Eastern Orthodox Christians and some Non-denominational Evangelical Christians believe this. I suspect it is a minority opinion but there is no way to know. There are no established scientific, historical, philosophical, theological or scriptural foundations for this belief. I’m guessing, but I think that among Christians of all major traditions, including big-C Catholics, few people have even given this any thought or even heard about it.
The latest mystery was unveiled by Gary Habermas at an apologetics conference sponsored by the Southern Evangelical Seminary. Stoyan Zaimov wrote on Habermas’ findings in an article on Christian Post.
Using enhanced photography, Habermas and his team noticed — though the individual’s mouth is closed — his teeth are visible through the skin and beard.
“His skin is intact, his beard is intact, but you are able to see what’s inside coming out, just like you are able to see what’s on the back of a hand,” said Habermas.
This left Habermas wondering if it was the result of a radiation burst, as it mimicked what happens during an x-ray. It would suggest there was a burst of radiation or something similar occurring inside Jesus’ body at the moment He resurrected.
Unveiled? It is not a recent observation. I think people were noticing this before Gary was born. And what is this about Gary’s team? Does he have a team? Using advanced photography? I don’t think Gary has done anything more than look at pictures made by others.
He (and his team) has/have wondered if certain characteristics of the image were the result of radiation? I’d like to know how many years after John Jackson, a physicist, wondered these things did Gary wonder these things. Did he? What did he say? No, really! Look, Gary is a good historian and a fine biblical scholar. He has read a few things and bought into them.
I’m reminded of the waiter in a fancy restaurant who said to me. “I can poach a nice filet of sole for you in some veal stock or I can bake it with a touch of red basil and some house-smoked Hungarian paprika. Or I can grill it in pepper infused Greek olive oil . . . . “ In the kitchen he yells out, “Number 3 dry.”
In early 2013, Padua University conducted a radio carbon test of the Shroud giving it a date of between 280 BC and 220 AD — well within Jesus’ time frame. An earlier carbon test produced a later date.
No, Padua University did no such thing. In fact, no one at Padua University did any such thing. No one at any university did any such thing. No one did. No one. You can trace this sort of error back to science by press release. Think about the announcement for Giulio Fanti’s book.
I don’t want anyone believing the shroud is real because of such nonsense. And thus I may hurt some people’s feelings.
Anyone heard more about Fanti’s dating- who accepts it as authoritative?
Any thoughts? It gets tossed around quite a bit in other blogs and news accounts.
Fr. Duncan writes:
. . . It is a fizzle because this is not about the Holy Shroud. It is about the financial tremors felt all the way from Detroit’s looming bankruptcy. It is about the desperate need for revitalization of Turin’s local and regional economy. It is about Fiat, SKF, Dayco, Bertone, Cinzano, Martini & Rossi, Stet-Telecom Italia. There have been worse reasons for exposing the the sacred for viewing. We should not forget it is about people’s financial well-being. It is problematic, however, because the Holy Shroud belongs not to Turin but the world.
Don’t upset the vendor’s cart with your science. Mystery sells better.
The following three messages are extracted from the “official” Santa Sindone (Holy Shroud) website. I relied on Bing Translation.
Getting these political ducks in a row is important. We all know that. Now let’s see what happens. There appears to have been no outbound news feeds. This was all about deals and constituencies and politics.
Turin and Turin welcome with joy the announcement of a new exposition of the Holy Shroud.
The city that for almost 500 years with dedication and pride has a point so important to the central mystery of the Christian faith becomes the center of spirituality through a public display of the Holy cloth, who render extraordinary and intense year of the 200th anniversary of one of its most loved Saints Don Bosco has always been an important reference for the faithful and especially for young people.
In 2010-the year of the last exhibition of the cloth which, according to tradition, has wrapped the body of Jesus after his deposition from the cross-over two million faithful had crossed the gates of the Cathedral and an even greater number of people, thanks to the internet and television, had seen the shroud exposed in the presbytery of the Cathedral by accepting an invitation to reflection and prayer, to meditate on the appeal not to forget those in difficulty, and to contemplate, in the picture, the pain of every man ".
A recall is not new to this town that has, in its history and woven into its fibers, the attention towards each other, the ability to accommodate and include, the sense of a p human conscious and etas, and where the brotherhood has always been made of concrete actions; for centuries this city intimately linked to the Holy Shroud, with its endless meaning and its ability to speak to humanity.
A reminder that the city of saints will honor with Social sobriet and deep, welcoming the silent appeal to "go out from themselves, from their beliefs," in the words of the Pope who ceaselessly remembers, more than ever during the worst crisis, don’t forget the other and his suffering.
The city of Torino will therefore, as in the past, part of this appointment very high and exciting, providing its architectural heritage, cultural and artistic, professional experience and the willingness to actively contribute to its organization, providing hospitality and welcome to those who come from every part of Italy, of Europe and of the world.
Mayor of Turin
The Monstrance in recent years have shown that millions of pilgrims have come to Turin for a simple trip and visit a revered relic, but for something a little more intense and deep, touching the soul and spirit of each. Each Exhibition an event that sees interweaving history, faith and popular devotion to a spiritual journey that presents us with a great mystery: the death and resurrection of Christ. In recent occasions when the sacred Linen was exposed to the public the city and the entire area you are prepared very seriously at the event, in a climate of great respect for the pilgrims, which went beyond cultural and religious differences. Logistical aspects and the reception of the pilgrims have always functioned properly, thanks to an organizing Committee that has seen local governments work synergistically and thousands of volunteers to become true ambassadors of the territory, its traditions and its spiritual richness and civil.
The next extraordinary coincider Exposition with the celebrations for the 200th anniversary of the birth of St. John Bosco, that will see the Salesian family come from all over the world in the city where Santo sociale par excellence with the given example taught us that newspaper can and should be done to educate young people to enter responsibly in et. I’m sure Turin and Piedmont will give the right importance and create the right setting for two events so extraordinary, organizing welcoming initiatives and information at the height of the image and of the international eputazione of the city.
President of the province of Torino
Message from the President of the Piedmont Region
And a membership convinced that as President of the region I intend to give the Committee on the exposition of the shroud. The sacred Linen has a reference for many centuries the faithful, but also a scientific case that continues to arouse interest. Piemonte and Torino are now for a long time, the custodians of the shroud and just so that local institutions compete with the great responsibility of hosting a historic object and symbol cos of great spiritual values. By believer, together with my family, I had the good fortune to participate in the last Exposition: a unique experience, honestly touching, especially because shared with thousands of other worshippers. Beyond the personal religious beliefs of, however, I believe that the valorisation of the shroud can be an opportunity to relaunch the many religious itineraries that our area has to offer.
President Of Piedmont Region
I was looking for a list of present and past organizations that are or were involved with the Holy Shroud of Turin. The list compiled and maintained by Messer’s Marino and Schwortz at http://www.shroud.com/centers.htm is wonderful. I can only imagine how much work went into it. My profound thanks.
Might I suggest that the web-page show the date of the latest update and provide a button for reporting necessary changes. For instance I note that the URL addresses for
- 1/ The Garden Tomb Shroud Center
- 2/ Holy Face Monastery
- 3/ August Accetta’s Shroud Center of Southern California
- 4/ Richmond Shroud of Turin Center
are defunct and the domains are for sale. I don’t mind the dead URL’s. I’m not complaining. This list is wonderful.
Any other scrubs? Additions? Updates?
Formatting note: I added the bullets into the email from the reader. And I add my thanks; lists like this are very useful.
None of the mainstream wire services have touched the 2015 exhibition announcement. You would think Religion News Service would mention it. Vatican Insider has so far ignored it. So has the Catholic Herald. No mention in the Christian Post. And isn’t this just the sort of story that the Telegraph, Guardian and Huffington Post love to opine about.
The calm before the storm? It doesn’t feel that way.