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SSG Member Wants to Know
A member of the Shroud Science Group (unnamed at this time) asks:
I wish to know if there are reliable sources (especially of historical type) documenting answers to the following questions.
- Of which material was composed the Chambéry’s reliquary?
- Which was the composition of the silver alloy that probably composed the reliquary?
- Did the reliquary contained lead perhaps in the silver alloy?
I think the emphasis is on reliable sources.
Why Didn’t I Think of That
Had there been that iconic double image – both sides of the same man, aligned
head-to-head – in someone or other’s possession for 1300 or years prior to Lirey,
it would have leaked out into the public domain
— Colin Berry
Typically and daily, well over three thousand people see each and every new posting to this blog. It may arrive in their inbox as one of the 787 emails that go every time I post something. It may arrive via Twitter and Facebook. On average, one thousand people access a posting from search engines or subject-specific news feeds like Yahoo. Hundreds type in the URL or click on a book mark.
Some will skim the first few lines, if that. Some will read the whole posting before chucking it. There is, however, a hardcore group that reads the posts carefully and writes comments. These comments often lead to wonderful discussions by several people, almost all of them people better informed and a heck of a lot smarter than me when it comes to the shroud. Often, the topic drifts. That’s fine.
Now and then someone writes something that grabs your attention. For instance, this morning I saw the following by Colin Berry. It made me stop and think. I don’t like what Colin wrote because maybe it’s true and I am hoping someone smarter than me will respond:
Had there been that iconic double image – both sides of the same man, aligned head-to-head – in someone or other’s possession for 1300 or years prior to Lirey, it would have leaked out into the public domain, if only as a rumour. It would have required just one quick sketch, scarcely more than graffiti, to become an instantly recognizable logo, signalling the sheet that enveloped the crucified Jesus, leaving his supposed faint bloodied imprint of BOTH sides.
But there’s no record pre-1355 of any such iconic double image. So why not just accept that the double-image did not exist before the mid-14th century?
And then the topic drifts; call it a two for one comment from Colin. I wonder why Colin thinks what he thinks:
… Why not regard it as an ingenious artefact that has (allegedly) perplexed the brightest and best of modern day scientists? Or has it? Which top notch scientists have been invited to examine it? If anyone here knows of any, then please name them and their research achievements. Don’t be content to say they were “experts” or highly regarded in their chosen field. State the discoveries and insights for which they are famous.
I say the TS has never been investigated by a top notch scientist associated with a major discovery, no disrespect to the Hellers, Adlers, Rogers etc, certainly not of Nobel Prize standard. Yet the UK institute where one of my medically-qualified offspring works does immunological research is reputed as having a still-active Nobel Prize winner on every floor! They do exist, and I’ve no doubt some are quite approachable. Why has the TS not been evaluated by someone of that standing? …
To my way of thinking, the acclaim that a scientist is top notch and the nominations for prizes and fellowship usually stem from accomplishments made before fame. I think, for instance, of Jonas Salk. He was not an acclaimed top notch scientist or a prize winner when he saw the possibility of developing a polio vaccine. To quote Julius Youngner, a scientist interviewed for a PBS documentary, “Jonas was a young whippersnapper who came out of nowhere, and suddenly is taking on this responsibility…”
I don’t like Colin’s argument. But others might. He does have a point, however, that can well be directed at some who make exaggerated claims of credentials for shroud scientists and sometimes so-called scientists.
If you want to read the whole discussion, and you should if you have not, visit A Must Read Regarding the Othon de la Roche Hypothesis. There are, as of this moment, 40 thoughtful, thought-provoking comments.
‘Tis the Season: An Unusual Way to Sell Shroud-Based Art Of A Sort
Yeah, right: “This OFFICIAL, non-profit website is dedicated to sharing The Man In The Cloth Portrait with all, regardless of race, color or Creed.”
The site is elegant; he must have put a lot of work into it. Through his site, you can donate to this guy’s non-profit* or you can buy a Master Edition two-foot by three-foot copy of his work, on canvas, for a mere $6,850.00 or a signed and numbered paper print for $101.00 (but be fast because the artist will increase the price by one dollar for each one he sell or something like that) . You can also have a postcard sized print for $19.00.
Here is what E. Laurence Bake, the artist, says on the home page of his website:
But now, with the tools of modern computer technology, space-age photography and the hands of a truly inspired artist, E. Laurence Bake, a stunning new reality has been REVEALED – a mathematically precise, magnificently rendered, life-like "Portrait of the Man In The Cloth." And who could have imagined such precise facial features, or the stunning masculinity and profound gaze of love, understanding and spirituality that has awaited Man’s discovery for centuries.
In this OFFICIAL online exhibition The Man In The Cloth is now fully revealed, visible for all of us to marvel at and wonder: What kind of glorious creator (God or artist) could have possibly made and preserved such powerful masculinity, such beauty in a simple piece of cloth? As International businessman, Vijay Kumar put it, "It’s as if he is emerging out of the darkness of Man’s violent past, into the light of the new modern age. The Shroud is the image of a crucified man, yet when I look into those eyes all I see is pure love and compassion."
Retired ship Captain, Val LaFrance commented, "How could anything so magnificent be hidden in the threads of a linen cloth, waiting until Man could fly ships to the stars and the tools of the modern age were capable of revealing His existence? It’s a masterpiece."
Yet another viewer concluded, "It is an invitation to humanity to look beyond the limits of the material world and ask: what treasures might the human spirit hold? What kind of world could we create if love and compassion replaced hatred and violence on Earth?"
This OFFICIAL, non-profit website is dedicated to sharing The Man In The Cloth Portrait with all, regardless of race, color or Creed. We are also dedicated to providing you with only the finest, highest quality reproductions of The Portrait possible with todays technology. Every Limited Edition released is designed to hold its value, color and beauty for the next 100 years.
* I just wonder if this Florida-based non-profit fellow has filed a 501(c)3 with the IRS. And what does OFFICIAL mean?
That Book That Keeps on Giving
If you must buy a new copy you can have the only one left in stock for a mere $71.95. Do you really think more are on the way? Tell that someone special, if this is a Christmas gift, that you found a treasured heritage edition of Harry Gove’s Relic, Icon of Hoax?. Just click on used and pick up an almost new copy for a mere 59 cents (plus about $4.00 for shipping).
Hat tip to Joe Marino.
Where to Get Shroud-Based Art for Christmas
Works of art by Ray Downing (The Real Face of Jesus) is for sale at Fine Art America. Various display quality formats* are available including folded greeting cards.
CLICK ON IMAGE TO THE RIGHT FOR LARGER VIEW
A 24 x 30 canvas print with metal frame will set you back $351.10. Smaller sizes are available.
Ray Downing is an Emmy winning 3D digital artist. In 2010 he created the Virtual Abraham Lincoln, which was featured in the History Channel special ‘Stealing Lincoln’s Body’. The following year he created a Virtual Jesus using the 3D information found in the Shroud of Turin. The Virtual Jesus appeared in another History Channel special entitled ‘The Real Face of Jesus?’ which was nominated for several international non-fiction awards and has been aired around the world.
* Canvas, Acrylic, Metal, Poster, Greeting Cards
We also learn from the STERA Facebook page that …
In case you missed it, our Backlit Shroud Face transparency in 11" x 14" PhotoGlow Frame is ON SALE until December 31, 2015. Each transparency is mounted in a custom frame only 13/16" thick and is ready to hang. The built-in LED backlighting system is equipped with an inline dimmer that allows you to adjust and control the brightness of the backlight display. Read more [here] … or click on the photo below for details. This is a great gift for those who want to display a truly striking image of the Shroud in their homes or offices.
There is a lot of other stuff at the STERA, Inc. Shroud of Turin Website Store
New Presentation by Russ Breault
Russ Breault tells us on the Shroud Encounter Facebook page:
I have developed a new presentation specifically for Art museums and schools of art to explore the subject from that perspective. Here is a descriptor of the talk:
Art, Icon or Relic?—The Role of Art in Exploring and Revealing an Ancient Mystery
Is the famous Shroud of Turin the work of a medieval artist? Is it a religious icon or is it a relic of a historical event? No one knows for sure. Explore the mystery from the rich realm of art.
This comprehensive presentation will look at:
• Art as historical depiction
• Art copies of the original
• Influence of the Shroud on Byzantine art
• Comparison of art during the middle ages
• Mechanics of art such as style, technique, substances and process.Program will make use of over 200 images. 90 minutes
Searching for Papers
A reader writes:
… you know that by typing in “shroud.com/pdfs" you get a list of all of the pdf papers on the site in alphabetical order. This can be useful in doing research. You should let others on your blog know.
Actually, the pdfs directory is not the only place pdf files are stored on the site.
The preferred method, to my way of thinking, is to use the following Google search:
site:shroud.com/ filetype:pdf
If you want to limit yourself to the pdfs directory (why would you?) modify the command so it reads thus:
site:shroud.com/pdfs/ filetype:pdf
If you want to search elsewhere, you may. For instance:
site:holyshroudguild.org/ filetype:pdf
site:shroudencounter.com/ filetype:pdf
site:shroud.it/ filetype:pdf
With any of these searches, it is a good idea to add some words like shroud or pollen or whatever is your particular interest of the moment.
If you start your search with Google Advanced Search, you can specify a language.
Academia.edu is altogether another matter. It is a rich archive of papers on the shroud – probably the largest and you’ll find many newer English language papers there – but you can’t search it with Google or any of the other major search engines if you specify a filetype. So don’t. On the other hand, it is a good bet that whatever it is you find in Academia.edu, it will be a PDF file. And using words like Shroud and Turin are a must. For instance the following work well in Google:
site:academia.edu shroud of turin
Is the Shroud real? Probably.
The Shroud of Turin may be the real burial cloth of Jesus. The carbon dating, once seemingly proving it was a medieval fake, is now widely thought of as suspect and meaningless. Even the famous Atheist Richard Dawkins admits it is controversial. Christopher Ramsey, the director of the Oxford Radiocarbon Laboratory, thinks more testing is needed. So do many other scientists and archeologists. This is because there are significant scientific and non-religious reasons to doubt the validity of the tests. Chemical analysis, all nicely peer-reviewed in scientific journals and subsequently confirmed by numerous chemists, shows that samples tested are chemically unlike the whole cloth. It was probably a mixture of older threads and newer threads woven into the cloth as part of a medieval repair. Recent robust statistical studies add weight to this theory. Philip Ball, the former physical science editor for Nature when the carbon dating results were published, recently wrote: “It’s fair to say that, despite the seemingly definitive tests in 1988, the status of the Shroud of Turin is murkier than ever.” If we wish to be scientific we must admit we do not know how old the cloth is. But if the newer thread is about half of what was tested – and some evidence suggests that – it is possible that the cloth is from the time of Christ.
No one has a good idea how front and back images of a crucified man came to be on the cloth. Yes, it is possible to create images that look similar. But no one has created images that match the chemistry, peculiar superficiality and profoundly mysterious three-dimensional information content of the images on the Shroud. Again, this is all published in peer-reviewed scientific journals.
We simply do not have enough reliable information to arrive at a scientifically rigorous conclusion. Years ago, as a skeptic of the Shroud, I came to realize that while I might believe it was a fake, I could not know so from the facts. Now, as someone who believes it is the real burial shroud of Jesus of Nazareth, I similarly realize that a leap of faith over unanswered questions is essential.
My name is Dan Porter. Please email me at DanielRobertPorter@gmail.com
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