Colin Berry writes on his Science Buzz blog, Suddenly, it’s discovered that one of "Jesus’s" arms on the Turin Shroud is dislocated. Now there’s a surprise. Colin even touches on the possibility that a suggestion by him led to the dislocation theory:
Alternative narrative? This blogger suggested many moons ago that the TS image was imprinted as a scorch onto linen by a medieval-era artisan from a heated life-sized bronze of the crucified Christ. But there was a problem. The arms of the latter were still in crucifixion mode. They needed to to be sawn off and re-positioned, hands over groin, to make the image look respectably post-mortem, modesty-protecting, those hands acting fig-leaf fashion ‘down there’ so as not to offend the ladies.
Crucified Christ? Maybe. Or there again, maybe a latter-day Templar knight, like, hint, hint, a falsely-condemned martyr (Jacques de Molay? Geoffroi de Charney?), liquidated in Philip IV of France’s purge of the order, involving initially the lengthy imprisonment (7 years), spasmodic torture and – finally – execution on a Seine island in the centre of gay Paree by slow-roasting over coals in 1314.
If one’s to be considered a scientist (as distinct from an agenda-driven apologist for the Christian faith – or at any rate one variant thereof) one cannot ignore alternative scenarios, least of all those that fit the radiocarbon dating (1260-1390).
My title ("Now there’s a surprise"). What made our sindonologist friends suddenly discover a "dislocated arm at the shoulder"? Not by any chance the suggestion that one or both arms of an existing bronze template had been detached and re-positioned so as to make a more convincing template?
It is a relatively good posting up to the point where Colin dislocates his own shoulder trying to pat himself on the back.
Seems an odd pairing to have the head facing straight ahead, with the eyes closed on such a crucifix. Most artists tilt the head slightly downward, or angled to one side to signify death. If the head is facing straight-on, wouldn’t the eyes likely be shown open, looking straight ahead or upward? I suppose some variation could exist. A crown of thorns is usually depicted in sculptures, doesn’t appear to be the case here. Could have been an add-on item to contrast with the sculpture or chipped away, smoothed out-why not? As to alternatives, quite a serene expression for someone being slow roasted-maybe they used a lot of butter.
Dislocated right shoulder is no new discovery. It has been known for a long time.
This ImageJ 3D reconstruction of the TS man shows it very clearly:
http://ok.apologetyka.info/upload/ap_upload/articles/15/2013/06/rysunekxvi.jpg
As I wrote yesterday, the dislocated shoulder has been on my mind for some years now. It is likely that Mel Gibson was influenced by the Shroud image to shoot the scene where Jesus’ right hand is nailed to the cross after being pulled to the “right length” by the centurion. Obviously he did not make use of the rest like the position of the nails because the relic hasnot yet been authenticated and he took Anne Catherine Emmerich and Christian art in general into consideration.
It is likely that Mel Gibson was influenced by the Shroud image to shoot the scene where Jesus’ right hand is nailed to the cross after being pulled to the “right length” by the centurion.
The scene is derived from Anne Catherine. The notable difference is that in this case left hand is stretched.:
When the executioners had nailed the right hand of our Lord, they perceived that his left hand did not reach the hole they had bored to receive the nail, therefore they tied ropes to his left arm, and having steadied their feet against the cross,pulled the left hand violently until it reached the place prepared for it. This dreadful process caused our Lord indescribable agony, his breast heaved, and his legs were quite contracted. They again knelt upon him, tied down his arms, and drove the second nail into his left hand; his blood flowed afresh, and his feeble groans were once more heard between the blows of the hammer, but nothing could move the hard-hearted executioners to the slightest pity. The arms of Jesus, thus unnaturally stretched out, no longer covered the arms of the cross, which were sloped; there was a wide space between them and his armpits.
(from http://www.catholicplanet.com/ebooks/Dolorous-Passion.pdf)
“As I wrote yesterday, the dislocated shoulder has been on my mind for some years now. It is likely that Mel Gibson was influenced by the Shroud image to shoot the scene where Jesus’ right hand is nailed to the cross after being pulled to the “right length” by the centurion. Obviously he did not make use of the rest like the position of the nails because the relic hasnot yet been authenticated and he took Anne Catherine Emmerich and Christian art in general into consideration.”
Re: The Passion-apparently, Jim Caviezel suffered a shoulder dislocation during filming at some point
http://movies.about.com/od/thepassion/a/passion082504.htm
No wonder,given the brutality shown in the scenes. Both Gibson (Australian) and Caviezel(American) are devout Catholics, the former more conservative and that is why he based many of his ideas on Emmerich.
I am sceptical when it comes to visions, and it becomes less when concrete results are seen and if I get my own “feel”.While touring Europe when I was very young, Fatima, Portugal could be “felt”, there was a sort of “strange”, sad atmosphere there, very different from Lourdes, France. Francisco’s body was found incorrupt when exhumed to be taken to the basilica and USSR communism came to an end, which had been hooked on to a request during the apparition. During a general audience in Rome, sitting about 15 feet away from Paul VI together with a group on the stage, the feeling of saintliness in the man was unmistakable. It could be seen on his face, his manner and this week’s news about his beatification is no surprise.
Orthopaedic surgeons VL Caja and MM Revert-Vinaixa, on the other hand, in their letter to Injury Journal responding to Bevilacqua’s first paper say: “Blunt violent trauma on the right shoulder: Simply, there is no evidence.”
Louis, I believe that Jacinta of Fatima was also incorrupt.
“When the tomb of Jacinta was opened in 1951
her body was found practically incorrupt. Her
remains are also entombed in the transept of the
basilica at the Cova da Iria. …”
Source : “Jacinta’s Death”
Link :
http://www.fatima.org/crusader/truestory/pdf/tspg65.pdf
and,
under another address :
http://soulhunter182.wordpress.com/2014/03/25/blessed-jacinta-of-fatima-and-her-incorrupt-body/
There are the following words :
>On Sept. 12, 1935, 15 years after her death, Jacinta’s body
was found to be incorrupt, as shown in the photograph
taken at the time that her sealed coffin was opened.
>They discovered that Jacinta’s body was measurably longer
than at the time of her burial. She had continued to grow
even in death. Her body had been wrapped in that coffin
from 1935 to 1951. They prepared a new coffin at that time
and found her body had grown.
— —
Under the address :
http://www.pbase.com/shaunwin/fatima_burial_site
> … Jacinta body was incorruptible, in the first exam and final move
several years later. There was no odor during the exhume, instead
the Rose fragrance came from Jacinta’s incorruptible body. …
and
>Father Ludwig Fischer who was present at the The first exhumation
of Jacinta’s body, on September 12, 1935 Fr. Fischer wrote:
“The expression on Jacinta’s face was that of great peace, and all
who saw her could not help feeling that they were greatly privileged
to have been granted such a favor.” This was all the more
extraordinary because lye was poured into the tomb to hasten
disintergration of the body of Francisco who was “buried in 1919.
Jacinta was buried in the family plot on top of her brother. Her Nurse Nadeja Silvestre said: In her extreme suffering before she died, Jacinta’s face had looked worn and emaciated. But in death, her cheeks had filled out and had taken on a healthy color. “She did not look the same child; she had become radiant and beautiful.” … …
http://speramus-hope.blogspot.it/2014/02/memorial-of-blessed-jacinta-and.html
Hi Chesterbelloc, it could be, but I have no information now. Another case worth investigation is the body of Karl I von Hapsburg-Lothringen, the last emperor of the Austro Hungarian empire, which is lying in Madeira, Portugal and may be taken to Vienna in the future to be buried in the family crypt:
http://realnews247.com/pictures_king_karl_I_austria.htm
On original posting announcing the Fanti et al paper concerning dislocated shoulder, I wrote, May 9, 12:00am, concerning Barbet’s views on dislocated shoulder:
“He (Barbet) writes: “… there has been a good deal of talk about the arms being lengthened by dislocation, and I have had some difficulty in convincing good friends of the shroud who are not, however, versed in anatomy; this is a matter that need some understanding. Dislocation could only take place in the joints of the shoulder and the elbow. A dislocation of one or the other would shorten the arm and would not lengthen it.” A shortening is not what is seen on the Shroud image. The result of suspension from the wrists can result in an elongation of four or five centimetres at the most, and this conforms to the geometry of the arm taking up the position from horizontal to 65deg as the hypoteneuse of the triangulation. “Doctor at Calvary” Pierre Barbet, 1963; ‘The Wounds of the Hands, p.107. Barbet had his original French work published in 1950;”
My views on alleged dislocation of shoulder, remain neutral pending more authoritative comment from forensic pathology. However, Barbet seems not to have thought so, and his opinion matters more so than the speculations of film producers, visionaries, chemistry doctorates advocating hot statues with arms broken off, and even Italian professors with a miraculist agenda. I remain unpersuaded.
On June 23, 2013 at 3:22 pm I wrote:
“The true fact is a loosely draped body actually is totally inconsistent with the Greek verbs used in the Gospel to describe Yeshua’s body wrapping in shrouds: entulisso, “to wrap, encircle, wind”; eneileo, “to compress, tightly wrap up” and deo, “to fasten, bind”.
As wrapping in shrouds was/is one of the Judean/Jewish burial core procedures, in order to counteract arms forced in rigor mortis from adduction to abduction, a crucifixion victim’s bloody body fastening/binding + compressing/tightly wrapping up were most needed.
The true fact is the TS bloodstain cartography implies a tightly wrapped up cloth-to-body front and back configuration. During the bloody body image formation process (as the cloth got somewhat taut again via shrinking and resulted in a new configuration), the arm counteracted rigor mortis was recorded in terms of image distortion (right hand with elongated ‘bony’ fingers + unequal abducted arm length).”