Video from Turin Appearing on YouTube. Expect More.
We are starting to get video from today in YouTube. This clip runs about nine minutes.
Recommended: Barrie Schwortz on CNN
Amongst all the hoopla, I missed linking to this earlier. This is a very significant interview with Barrie Schwortz, founder and editor of Shroud.com with CNN about the appearance of the shroud on TV again, the failure of the carbon dating, the unsolved mystery of the image and the new iPhone app. Click HERE or on the image to watch this four minute segment.
Res ipsa loquitur: The facts speak for themselves.
![clip_image001[4]](http://shroudofturin.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/clip_image00141.jpg?w=309&h=206 "clip_image001[4]")
This is from a very important posting by John Klotz in his blog, Living Free. Read the whole posting. The following, pretty much the last third of the posting, should give you an idea why:
The Shroud.com story also carries an attack by the Turin authorities on Fanti’s claim that he had carried out tests on a fibers of the Shroud obtained from (ta da) Ray Rogers. The Turin authorities not authorized the fibers to be transferred. The Fanti research was thus unauthorized.
But now the plot thickens considerably. In his 2005, Rogers published a paper in Thermahemica Acta that specifically stated how he had received samples of the carbon related to the carbon dating area of the Shroud:
“[I] received 14 yarn segments from the Raes sample from Prof. Luigi Gonella (Department of Physics, Turin Polytechnic University) on 14 October 1979. I photographed the samples as received and archived them separately in numbered vials. Some of the samples were destroyed in chemical tests between 1979 and 1982, but most of the segments have been preserved.” Thermochimica Acta Volume 425, Issues 1-2 , 20 January 2005, Pages 189-194
At that time, Gonella was the duly appointed Scientific Adviser to the Archbishop of Turin. In the same paper, Rogers further reported:
“On 12 December 2003, I received samples of both warp and weft threads that Prof. Luigi Gonella had taken from the radiocarbon sample before it was distributed for dating. Gonella reported that he excised the threads from the center of the radiocarbon sample.”
I do not feel I can comment currently on Fanti’s “Mystery of the Shroud.” As of yet there is no English translation available. But I can comment on this: Roger’s 2005 statements are a “past recollection recorded.” While it was not contemporaneously recorded, it certainly is evidence of an chains of possession which began with Prof. Gonella, now deceased.
It may be that the authorities in Turin do not wish to authenticate Fanti’s work by denying official confirmation of his samples authenticity. Yet, in law they have a principal of evidence expressed in Latin: Res ipsa loquitur.” The facts speak for themselves.
John C, Klotz
Now read the whole posting. I agree with it.
Royal Society Involvement: It will not happen
Mike B. in Wisconsin writes:
I noticed that one of your blog’s readers, Dr. Colin Berry, wants to involve the Royal Society of London and its president, Dr. Paul North, in an examination of possible pseudoscientific practices in Shroud of Turin research. It will not happen.
While it is true, as Dr. Berry points out, that Dr. North has rightly stated that it is the duty of scientists to expose pseudoscience, we must remember that he does so only when it relates to important public policy issues such as climate change.
Just this past week, Dr. North gained two powerful allies, the new Pope in Rome and the Church of England’s new Archbishop of Canterbury on the home front. Pope Francis understands the issue. His words have been clear. He will be a powerful voice for the environment on the world stage. The Most Revd Lord Welby, also committed to preventing global warming, will be most influential with the British government and private institutions throughout the Commonwealth.
Therefore, it is implausible to think that the leader of the Royal Society would become embroiled in what would certainly be perceived as a smack down of the church over unimportant questions about the authenticity of a relic many Catholics and some Anglicans revere. He will not do so. He is not that foolish.
Moreover, to do what is being asked of the Royal Society by Dr. Berry, and do it well, would require countless hours of costly research and entangle the Society in controversy for many years to come. It makes no sense. It will not happen.
I imagine Mike B is right about this.
The International Centre of Sindonology expresses reservations about Fanti-Gaeta volume
This is copied from a PDF file, “Official Statement from the International Centre of Sindonology” in English, Spanish and Italian. It resides at www.shroud.com and may be found from Late Breaking News. (The picture is not part of the file):
Referring to the news about the release of the volume “The Mistery of the Shroud” by Rizzoli, written by Giulio Fanti and Saverio Gaeta, supposedly dealing with research carried out on Shroud material, the International Centre of Sindonology has expressed reservations about the approach of the book to the theme. According to the International Centre of Sindonology, the volume has approached the subject through the analysis of some cloth samples which can not be proved to belong to the Shroud fabric as they can not be traced.
As far as this is concerned, the International Centre of Sindonology refers to the official statements about the “experiments and analysis concerning the Holy Shroud” made when analogous research was attempted on material supposedly belonging to the Shroud. Those statements were made on behalf of the Holy See, owner of the Shroud, by Cardinal Giovanni Saldarini in September 1995 and Cardinal Severino Poletto on 4th May 2009, “Papal Custodians of the Holy Shroud”.
Turin, September 1995
More and more reports are being published about experiments carried out on Shroud
material aiming to check the results of the tests conducted with the Carbon 14 method in
the summer of 1988. This purpose may be legitimate, and the Church recognizes to every
scientist the right to carry out appropriate research in their field of science. However,
given the circumstances, it is necessary to point out that:a) no new sample of material has been taken from the Holy Shroud since 21st April 1988,
and according to the Holy See and the Custodian of the Holy Shroud it is highly unlikely
that a third party may be in possession of any residual material from that sample;b) if such material exists, the Custodian reminds everybody that the Holy See has not
given its permission to anybody to keep it and use it and he therefore demands to give it
back to the Holy See;c) it is not possible to know with any degree of certainty whether or not such experiments
were carried out on material coming from the fabric of the Shroud. Therefore, the Holy
See and the Papal Custodian declare that no serious value can be recognized to the
results of those alleged experiments;d) this is evidently not the case of the research carried out on material taken for the tests
in October 1978 and following the explicit authorization of the Papal Custodian;e) within the climate of mutual trust established with scientists, the Holy See and the
Cardinal Archbishop of Turin encourage scientists to be patient until a clear and
systematically planned research programme is arranged.Giovanni Card. Saldarini
Archbishop of Turin
And there is this, too: Official statement of the Papal Custodian of the Holy Shroud, Mons. Cesare Nosiglia in English, Spanish and Italian.
Breaking News: Links to See the Shroud Now
Barrie Schwortz just found this link, possibly from a satellite feed, and posted it on his site (www.shroud.com) :
View the Television Exposition
Also, this is a bing translation from Ostension du Saint-Suaire de Turin:
Saturday Saint from 5: 10 p.m., it will be possible to follow on KTO the exceptional television ostension of the Holy Shroud of Turin. Decided by Benedict XVI, the ceremony will be held in camera in the Duomo. The ostension of half an hour will take place during the ceremony, which lasted 1 hour and a half.
That is 12:10 pm EDT (New York). I have a streaming picture. Anyone know Italian? And are these the same broadcasts? I just want to get it up there fast.
I also had the same picture without sound on my iPhone from a bootleg streaming site in France. It lasted two minutes then failed. No luck at all with the RAI streaming site.
Awaiting Live Stream from RAI Uno
Click HERE or on the image below to be taken to RAI Uno’s streaming page. let’s hope and assume that the message, “We apologize. The content is not available due to copyright restrictions,” will not appear during the exhibition.
- Saturday, March 30 – 11:10 a.m Italian time (10:10 a.m. GMT / 6:10 a.m. EDT) – RAI Uno – “A sua immagine”, Shroud Special: L’attesa dell’Ostensione (Waiting for the Exhibition)
- Saturday, March 30 – 5:15 p.m. Italian time (4:15 p.m. GMT / 12:15 p.m. EDT) – RAI Uno – “A sua immagine” – Sindone: i segni della Passione (Shroud: The Signs of the Passion)
Is the Shroud real? Probably.
The Shroud of Turin may be the real burial cloth of Jesus. The carbon dating, once seemingly proving it was a medieval fake, is now widely thought of as suspect and meaningless. Even the famous Atheist Richard Dawkins admits it is controversial. Christopher Ramsey, the director of the Oxford Radiocarbon Laboratory, thinks more testing is needed. So do many other scientists and archeologists. This is because there are significant scientific and non-religious reasons to doubt the validity of the tests. Chemical analysis, all nicely peer-reviewed in scientific journals and subsequently confirmed by numerous chemists, shows that samples tested are chemically unlike the whole cloth. It was probably a mixture of older threads and newer threads woven into the cloth as part of a medieval repair. Recent robust statistical studies add weight to this theory. Philip Ball, the former physical science editor for Nature when the carbon dating results were published, recently wrote: “It’s fair to say that, despite the seemingly definitive tests in 1988, the status of the Shroud of Turin is murkier than ever.” If we wish to be scientific we must admit we do not know how old the cloth is. But if the newer thread is about half of what was tested – and some evidence suggests that – it is possible that the cloth is from the time of Christ.
No one has a good idea how front and back images of a crucified man came to be on the cloth. Yes, it is possible to create images that look similar. But no one has created images that match the chemistry, peculiar superficiality and profoundly mysterious three-dimensional information content of the images on the Shroud. Again, this is all published in peer-reviewed scientific journals.
We simply do not have enough reliable information to arrive at a scientifically rigorous conclusion. Years ago, as a skeptic of the Shroud, I came to realize that while I might believe it was a fake, I could not know so from the facts. Now, as someone who believes it is the real burial shroud of Jesus of Nazareth, I similarly realize that a leap of faith over unanswered questions is essential.
My name is Dan Porter. Please email me at DanielRobertPorter@gmail.com
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